Curse

beanerman_99 · Mar 02, 2006, 03:18 PM // 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

Where do people get this idea that to be successful in PvE you need to cheat or get run to droks? My first character took a week to finish all the content I could find, and back then there was no droks running. The only missions I haven't gone through with just hench is THK and Thirsty River, but other people have. It doesn't matter what class you play, it's about knowing how to play it.

Take a look at bosses. Is there are reason they're called bosses and given unique names except to recognize which one has your elite? They pose no threat even to groups who dont have a clue what they're doing. Even Glint is feeble when you know how to do it, and it doesn't even require a specific group.

Sorry if this sounds arrogant, but if you find PvE challenging it's because of your own lack of skill or a bad group, not because the content is actually difficult.

/sigh

I don't even know how to respond to this, especially your last comment.

I guess what it all comes down to is our own personal definition of what we think is "challenging". I'll just leave it at that since neither of us is right or wrong in what we think. I don't really want to hijack the OP's thread on this subject anymore.

SOOOO aren't you all excited about exploring and having the "everything is new" feeling again? Everyone starting out equal? I think it will be a blast

Mustache Mayhem · Mar 02, 2006, 03:18 PM // 15:18

ha that's so true.. you can go through the whole pve game by yourself with henches/solo and it's fast.. the only headache you'll have is when you get in a pug with a bunch of crackpots you have to carry.. basically even then you can just lead the team and babysit the 2 year olds if you want a challenge.. the new pve tombs is pretty good but even that gets owned by the barrage/pet build in under an hour with a good pug- and it can be done with henches too

I think they made it this way though.. cause it kinda rewards people who like to solo- I know there's alot of pve'rs who can't run droks solo or clean out smites solo in any decent amount of time.. you can even run shiverpeaks with a monk but that's the draw to anyone who wants a challenge in pve.. if you say it's boring and you can't do any of these things- try it out =] the missions and quests are all too easy after you know what to expect

Keyote · Mar 02, 2006, 03:22 PM // 15:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by beanerman_99

SOOOO aren't you all excited about exploring and having the "everything is new" feeling again? Everyone starting out equal? I think it will be a blast

The first experience with new areas/content is always the best, so yes I do know what you mean. It's the nature of these games though that after a while people work out the ultimate builds and fastest route to achieving something. It's never really a good thing, but it's unavoidable and happens to them all.

wolfe2dale · Mar 02, 2006, 03:23 PM // 15:23

I need to be careful here apparently...

My previous posts have been removed for no apparent reason that I can find...

I just feel that pve holds quite enough challenge for the vast majority of players in GW & that it is unfair of some people to make everyone else feel that they are not a good player for not running through game in a week, as seems to be the claim here...

By the way, what did you do, play 24 hours a day or something? That seems an awfully quick time to complete all pve content?

beanerman_99 · Mar 02, 2006, 03:30 PM // 15:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

The first experience with new areas/content is always the best, so yes I do know what you mean. It's the nature of these games though that after a while people work out the ultimate builds and fastest route to achieving something. It's never really a good thing, but it's unavoidable and happens to them all.

So true and so hard for developers to stop this from happening. Happens with every single game on the market. Its sad. Takes all the fun out of the game. And I hate how it can possibly shut out the "average" player. Like the 5 man oro teams and the b/p teams. Sad for the average Joe who played through the game with a mesmer and then they want to go in a see what FoW is like but no one wants them in the group.

Keyote · Mar 02, 2006, 03:33 PM // 15:33

I played quite a lot, but not nearly 24/7. Thats all the missions and side quests I could find, not to say there weren't some I missed.

It's generally not the players fault if they find missions hard so I'm not saying they all lack skill, it's because no matter how good you are PUGs have several people refusing to work together because each one thinks they know best. Unless you cooperate and have one person giving directions and advice for those who dont know what to do, things will go wrong.

The Real Roy Keane · Mar 02, 2006, 03:36 PM // 15:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfe2dale

I need to be careful here apparently...

My previous posts have been removed for no apparent reason that I can find...

z0mg that's anti semetic! B4n him plz.

wsmcasey · Mar 02, 2006, 03:52 PM // 15:52

I just made a necro that I rushed thru the game. Once I ascended and got my level up high I decided to start doing missions only to find out that 95% of the people are running or getting ran just like I was. My new necro is my 4th character thru the game and I just came back to the game after taking 2 months off. It's nearly impossible to get a team going to do missions, except for Thunderhead, because you can't skip that mission to get to hells precipice. I'm currently in Thunderhead and attempted the mission last night with a bunch of idiots that don't know how to play the game. We lost of course.

wolfe2dale · Mar 02, 2006, 04:04 PM // 16:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keyote

I played quite a lot, but not nearly 24/7. Thats all the missions and side quests I could find, not to say there weren't some I missed.

It's generally not the players fault if they find missions hard so I'm not saying they all lack skill, it's because no matter how good you are PUGs have several people refusing to work together because each one thinks they know best. Unless you cooperate and have one person giving directions and advice for those who dont know what to do, things will go wrong.

I guess I just get fed up of so many players going on about how they owned the whole game & how it was sooooo easy.

I realise that's not what you have said here Keyote, so please don't get annoyed

I didn't find the game that difficult myself when I played my Elementalist, (except Thunderhead), but that's because I have been lucky with my groups, a good team of talented players can turn a reasonably hard mission into a quite easy one.

Most people, as you have pointed out above, do'nt get anywhere near as lucky as that.

When I played my Necro though, I had a really tough time, lots of bad pugs with leavers & crazed W/M's made some of the missions almost impossible.

& I'm sorry, no matter what anyone says, some of the missions just cannot be done with henchies... In particular the Aurora Glade & the Thirsty River mission's.

Kakumei · Mar 02, 2006, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfe2dale

& I'm sorry, no matter what anyone says, some of the missions just cannot be done with henchies... In particular the Aurora Glade & the Thirsty River mission's.

The UW can't be soloed.

The Ruins of Tombs can't be cleared under an hour.

IWAY cannot hold HoH.

Four Paladin presets can't win several rounds in TA.

Cannot is a strong word. Don't assume something can't be done just because you haven't done it.

wolfe2dale · Mar 02, 2006, 04:14 PM // 16:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakumei

The UW can't be soloed.

The Ruins of Tombs can't be cleared under an hour.

IWAY cannot hold HoH.

Four Paladin presets can't win several rounds in TA.

Cannot is a strong word. Don't assume something can't be done just because you haven't done it.

Kakumei,

After our last altercation can we just agree to disagree please? It would be easier all round.

wsmcasey · Mar 02, 2006, 04:47 PM // 16:47

I can solo Thirsty River with my MM and henchies. Not that hard.

Urfin · Mar 02, 2006, 04:54 PM // 16:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfe2dale

& I'm sorry, no matter what anyone says, some of the missions just cannot be done with henchies... In particular the Aurora Glade & the Thirsty River mission's.

I do disagree. Thirsty can be downright soloed, let alone henched. Aurora, you just, well, slaughter them and that's about it.

Of course, that doesn't mean that PVE is too easy. It's not - I died on some missions the first time I've done them, sometimes not once, and many people don't even dare try the later ones without a PUG with 2 monks. While I find little contempt for the latter group, I don't think that PVE is too easy - it's just what it needs to be, hard for some, easy for some.

Keeper of Birds · Mar 02, 2006, 05:00 PM // 17:00

I think part of what I miss is the newness. Looking at many of the previous posts, people are saying it's easy. Well, yes it is, once you know the route, the skills to bring, the optimal group mix, etc.

I remember my first time through the game shortly after release. Chances were back then that you were in a PUG where noone had done the mission before. Noone knew where to go. Noone knew what enemies were coming. Remember the first time you met a Mursat with uninfused armor? Even the skills the enemies used were new.

That is what I am looking forward to in Factions- getting with a group of folks to explore the new content. I am going to take a break from forum spoilage until I figure it out at least once myself, or with a group, and then come back here to read how I should have done it!

Carinae · Mar 02, 2006, 05:24 PM // 17:24

I don't think the Bloodstone Fen bonus can be done with hench. They will attack the guardians.

Keyote · Mar 02, 2006, 05:32 PM // 17:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keeper of Birds

That is what I am looking forward to in Factions- getting with a group of folks to explore the new content. I am going to take a break from forum spoilage until I figure it out at least once myself, or with a group, and then come back here to read how I should have done it!

The exploring part yes, but people will still know their classes so well that it'll be easy. Unless they take into consideration the amount of expert players there are now and raise the difficulty.

Was having this discussion on another board, and IMO mobs shouldn't be restricted to player skills. If they had their own more powerful skills, especially bosses, it would make a huge difference. Just like they've done with tombs. The problem is AI cant match player skill, and raising their health or energy to insane levels still doesn't help when they're restricted a single class that can easily be overcome by a group of players.

Cherno · Mar 02, 2006, 07:17 PM // 19:17

I thought the PvE was pretty difficult on my first, and even second characters. It isn't that the game is easy, it is that as you progress through it on multiple characters, you know what to expect and some sound strategies to make things easier on yourself.

I still find challenges all the time, but they are mostly challenges I create for myself. That's the reason there is a level cap, to encourage players to work on their skill. Change your build, see what works and what doesn't.

I had never been to Dragon's Gullet before and went to help a group with my lvl20 warrior do Althea's Ashes. They finished it up and I said I was going to go on and explore. They all left, I was by myself and 'lo and behold I got that feeling again. It was the newness and not knowing what to expect from the area that made it fun for me.

It can get repetitive doing the same missions/quests over again, but make it a challenge for yourself.

boxterduke · Mar 02, 2006, 07:27 PM // 19:27

I'm kinda excited about Ch2 also, just imagine new world map, new areas, new collectors, and crafters and so on.
It will take a while till everything is on the net like now with ch2.
I remember back in May when I was looking for sites to see what armors look like.
Or even a map of the world.
Good times.

Funda · Mar 02, 2006, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tainek

No hes right, The Monsters and missions are easy, its PUGS that are difficult....

It's opinion-based. Theres no right or wrong to it. Plain and simple.

Kakumei · Mar 02, 2006, 07:58 PM // 19:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Funda

It's opinion-based. Theres no right or wrong to it. Plain and simple.

If you're saying that an opinion cannot be right or wrong, you should probably think that over, because that's blatantly incorrect.